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Boullier sluit breuk tussen McLaren en Honda niet uit

Boullier sluit breuk tussen McLaren en Honda niet uit

  • Gepubliceerd op 01 jun 2017 17:05
  • comments 54
  • Door: Rob Veenstra

McLaren en Honda zouden na afloop van dit seizoen zomaar eens uit elkaar kunnen gaan. Racing director Eric Boullier kon in gesprek met La Derniere Heure in elk geval niet garanderen dat Honda ook in 2018 motorenpartner van McLaren is. "Alles ligt open. We bevinden ons in de gelukkige positie dat we kunnen doen wat we willen doen", aldus de Fransman.

Hij vervolgt: "Voordat we naar onze advocaat stappen, zullen we eerst met elkaar om de tafel gaan en een oplossing proberen te vinden. Het is niet onze intentie om te breken met Honda. Uiteindelijk heb ik het niet voor het zeggen, maar bepalen de aandeelhouders van McLaren wat we zullen doen. We mogen niet vergeten dat we niets hoeven te betalen voor deze motoren."

Japanse mentaliteit

Honda werkt op een Japanse manier en die werkwijze sluit vooralsnog niet aan op de wensen van McLaren. Boullier: "Ik pendel heen en weer tussen Groot-Brittannië en Japan om meer betrokken te raken, maar dat verloopt stroef. Europeanen vinden het over het algemeen al moeilijk om Japanners te begrijpen, maar in de autosport is dat nog meer het geval."

"Hun Formule 1-aanpak is dat als iedereen de ene kant opgaan, zij de andere kant opgaan. Buitengewoon, maar voor Japan lijkt het te werken, want het land is nog steeds een wereldmacht. Maar in plaats van de verwachte drie jaar duurt het misschien wel zes, zeven of acht jaar om de top te bestormen. In de tussentijd is het voor ons een kwestie van overleven. Zolang je progressie boekt, is het prima. Maar het wordt steeds zwaarder om ons te motiveren en te overtuigen dat het gaat lukken."

Ben Dover

Posts: 2.105

Nou, dat is inderdaad zo, maar als er alsnog een breuk ontstaat, zullen ze toch echt motoren nodig hebben en die MOET één van de andere fabrikanten dan leveren. Het kan dus ook tactiek zijn ;)

Ik kan de Japanse cultuur zelf wel waarderen, maar het is voor Westerlingen vaak wel lastig te begrij... [Lees verder]

  • 4
  • 1 jun 2017 - 17:28
F1 Nieuws McLaren

Reacties (54)

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  • Ouw-sjagerijn

    Posts: 12.878

    Nou weet ik het ook niet meer.

    • + 0
    • 1 jun 2017 - 17:09
    • SCHOUTEN RACING FAN

      Posts: 3.933

      Honda gaat naar redbull

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 20:21
    • Edward M

      Posts: 1.054

      Ben dan toch wel benieuwd met welke motoren Merc en Ferrari willen geen top teams leveren

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 21:03
    • ringo

      Posts: 3.629

      mclaren is niet meer de top , dus mercedes zal niet meer bang hoeven zijn, maar ik denk zelf dat die klanten motoren gelmiteerd zijn. dus mclaren zal niet de volledige power hebben uit die ding

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 00:33
  • Cicero

    Posts: 1.281

    Ehm ze mogen toch helemaal niet meer overstappen, dat hadden ze begin mei moeten melden

    • + 0
    • 1 jun 2017 - 17:16
    • z0mer

      Posts: 2.104

      Regels zijn er om gebroken te worden, kan me in ieder geval niet voorstellen dat het problemen gaat opleveren. Het begint er in ieder geval wel steeds meer op te lijken, want als de geruchten waar blijken te zijn, dan is de update voor Canada niet alleen uitgesteld, maar volledig geschrapt.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 17:25
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      Nou, dat is inderdaad zo, maar als er alsnog een breuk ontstaat, zullen ze toch echt motoren nodig hebben en die MOET één van de andere fabrikanten dan leveren. Het kan dus ook tactiek zijn ;)

      Ik kan de Japanse cultuur zelf wel waarderen, maar het is voor Westerlingen vaak wel lastig te begrijpen hoe het daar werkt. Alles is totaal anders dan hier en dat is niet per definitie slecht natuurlijk, maar simpelweg anders. Ik heb ervaring met Japan, professioneel gezien, en je maat dingen mee die hier echt niet kunnen. Een voorbeeld: stel je maakt een deal via mail dat iets 10k kost en je vliegt naar Japan om het te halen. Dan kom je aan en dan zeggen ze: Oh ja, nu kost het 11.5k. Jij wil graag iets van mij hebben, dus dan moet je maar betalen, anders pech gehad. Het eergevoel is ook enorm en de economie zit totaal anders in mekaar dan hier. Je ziet in veel winkels en bedrijven niet eens een computer staan, maar faxen enz.. Het is een economie van ENORM veel kleine winkeltjes enz., waardoor elk verlies vrij weinig impact heeft. Als Jumbo zou omvallen, kun je in half NL meteen geen boodschappen meer doen, bij wijze van spreken. In Japan is het veel lokaler allemaal, veel veter verdeeld als het gaat om risico's enz.. En de cultuur is gewoon totaal verschillend. Simple as that. Het is alleen de vraag of het wenselijk is om binnen de F1 onbeperkt vast te blijven houden aan je cultuur en principes, zelfs als het je naam kapot maakt, maar ik denk dat zij meer eer halen uit het doorgaan en bij zichzelf blijven. Ik zou dan ook tegen McLaren willen zeggen: open je ogen en nok 'm zo snel mogelijk. Laat Honda maar terugkomen als ze een motor hebben die het doet. Ze hebben echt alle kansen gehad om zich te verbeteren. Sauber is toch al een ramp, dus die twee passen perfect bij mekaar.

      • + 4
      • 1 jun 2017 - 17:28
    • Boutsen

      Posts: 709

      Kunnen ze wel.

      De datum waarop ze bij de FIA hun motorleverancier voor volgend seizoen moeten bekendmaken is inderdaad al verstreken. Geen nieuws van McLaren betekent dus dat ze, technisch gezien, het bij Honda zullen houden.
      Echter, er is nog steeds een achterpoortje in het reglement, of is het een deur die wagenwijd openstaat? Een team kan na die due date nog steeds van leverancier veranderen mits toestemming van de andere teams. Het is de verwachting dat geen van de andere teams hier bezwaar tegen heeft.

      Voor 2018 ligt alles nog open. Het wordt ofwel Honda met de hulp van Ilmor en/of Mercedes mits Honda hulp van buitenaf wil aanvaarden en ter harte wil nemen of het wordt Mercedes tout court.

      • + 1
      • 1 jun 2017 - 22:06
    • Larry Perkins

      Posts: 47.777

      Vind alles prima maar laat alsjeblieft Brown en de Bolle erover ophouden totdat 100% zeker is wat het wordt voor 2018.
      Weet dat zoiets moeilijk is omdat er steeds naar gevraagd wordt maar stel een datum voordat je er nog oiets over kan zeggen, dat helpt zeker.

      • + 1
      • 1 jun 2017 - 23:59
    • ringo

      Posts: 3.629

      denk wel als mclaren een mercedes motoren hebben , redbull wel van zijn tak maakt

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 00:36
    • Remedy81

      Posts: 5.871

      @Ringo: Motor krijgt of heeft... niet hebben en wat in godsnaam betekend: " redbull wel van zijn tak maakt"

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 07:17
    • Arie54

      Posts: 4.960

      @BEN DOVER: Wel of geen interessante cultuur, ik heb er geen verstand van, doet niet ter zake. Feit is dat Honda er de afgelopen jaren niet in geslaagd is om een betrouwbare motor te leveren, en niet alleen in de F1, maar ook bij Indy.
      Wat het alternatief wordt voor McLaren, geen idee.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 09:30
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      Klopt Arie, ik zelf heb ook zoiets van: weg met dat hok. Maar ja, dan zal je net hebben dat ze volgend jaar ineens de beste motor hebben. Dat klinkt zo onlogisch, I know, maar alles kan. Een Mercedes blok is daarentegen altijd goed.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 09:42
    • brabham-bt50

      Posts: 11.760

      Zelf hele andere ervaringen met Japanners zeker als er afspraken over geld zijn gemaakt. Keurig afgesproken deel vooruit en altijd op tijd de centjes binnen. Uiteraard wel eigen manier van managen en werkwijze. Doorgaans zeer resultaat en kwaliteitsgericht.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 09:59
    • Jim Clark

      Posts: 2.981

      @BT50 dat zijn mijn ervaringen ook. Zoals Ben het omschrijft had ik meer met Arabische zakenlieden.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 12:10
    • brabham-bt50

      Posts: 11.760

      Ik heb zelf geen ervaring op zakengebied in het Midden-Oosten, maar kan me er wel wat bij voorstellen, maar dan ga ik af op verhalen van kennissen. Hoewel de VAE misschien toch wel een uitzondering zijn. Ook een wat Japans achtige mentaliteit daar aangaande kwaliteit, en bereid daarvoor te betalen.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 18:19
    • brabham-bt50

      Posts: 11.760

      @Ben, waar ben jij geweest in Japan? Ik ken Tokio redelijk, en Osaka en de omgeving erboven vrij goed (Nara) maar wat je zegt over kleine winkeltjes enzo herken ik maar deels. Wat jij omschrijft lijkt meer op Afrika. Ook daar (Japan) veel grote ketens, food en non-food. In bijna elk provinciestadje kom je bijv. wel een Kintetsu warenhuis tegen (zoiets als Cortes d Ingles) en zo ook supermarkten, restaurants, electronica etc.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 18:25
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      Met name in Tokio en Odate. Die kleine winkeltjes is meer een algemeen iets voor Japan. Niet overal in gelijke mate, maar het is wel de reden dat de economie zo sterk is daar. Daar doelde ik meer op ;)

      • + 0
      • 3 jun 2017 - 00:09
    • Numnum

      Posts: 4.863

      Er is ook een clausule dat men op basis van wanprestaties de overeenkomst kan ontbinnen.
      Daar gaat elke rechter in mee.
      Een contract zegt in deze geen ruck.

      • + 0
      • 4 jun 2017 - 00:03
  • Max-Machine

    Posts: 131

    Zou zo maar kunnen dat ze met Peugeot verder gaan

    • + 0
    • 1 jun 2017 - 17:18
    • Jim Clark

      Posts: 2.981

      Ja, nu Dennis weg is durven die misschien weer...na 23 jaar..

      • + 1
      • 1 jun 2017 - 20:23
  • z0mer

    Posts: 2.104

    Volgens Joe Saward staat er aankomende vrijdag een belangrijke vergadering op de planning.

    The other rumbling concern is the McLaren-Honda relationship with a major meeting taking place on the Friday. Everyone is being very tight-lipped about the outcome of these discussions. The word is that the Japanese are still not keen on getting help from their rivals (which is the fastest way to solve the problem) and want to continue to go through pain until it all comes right. This is the kind of philosophy that Mr Honda employed in building the company. He didn’t want his engineers to be frightened to innovate, but the problem with the F1 programme is that the company does not appear to be learning from its mistakes. McLaren cannot afford to strap itself to a rocket that is not flying. It has hung in with Honda for two and a half years of pain. In 2015 the partnership was ninth in the Constructors’ Championship. In 2016 it was sixth. This year, six races into the season, the team is 10th and last, the only team not to score a point. One can understand the frustration because McLaren is now beginning to get into a place where staff will start to leave because their input cannot overcome Honda’s problems. Holding on to good people is the toughest task in F1 and it is clear that McLaren is worried that more years of struggle will weaken the team, will make it less attractive to sponsors, and will damage its reputation. If the relationship is going to break down, Honda at least has a parachute in the form of Sauber, while McLaren could become a Mercedes customer for next year. The team might not win races, but the results would likely be better. Decisions are needed soon to avoid compromising the 2018 programmes.

    • + 2
    • 1 jun 2017 - 17:22
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      Ja joh, en terecht. Ik kan het helemaal begrijpen. Dit kan zo echt niet langer en als Honda zich te goed voelt om door anderen bedachte, maar bewezen techniek te gebruiken, zou ik ze ook eruit gooien. McLaren is gewoon een topteam, maar kan al jaren geen vuist meer maken. Bovendien moeten ze ook nog straatauto's verkopen.

      • + 1
      • 1 jun 2017 - 17:33
    • schwantz34

      Posts: 36.095

      Linksom (blijven) of rechtsom (Mercedes) Mclaren is de komende jaren ver verwijderd van een topteam.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 17:35
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      Dat hoeft niet per se zo te zijn. Dan zou Red Bull de komende jaren ook kansloos moeten zijn.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 17:42
    • Larry Perkins

      Posts: 47.777

      @Ben. Denk dat Honda een heel stuk verder van het padje is dan Renault.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 17:58
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      @Larry, Ja, dat denk ik ook, maar wat Schwantz zegt vat ik op als dat ze met Mercedes-motor ook niet kunnen meedoen en dat weet ik nog niet zo zeker.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 18:16
    • Bertrand Gachot

      Posts: 297

      @ Ben Dover, dat zijn ze ook, zie daar ook opnieuw de kritieken van Helmut Marko.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 20:20
    • Boutsen

      Posts: 709

      Die vergadering heeft reeds vorige vrijdag plaats gevonden tijdens de Monaco GP en dus niet morgen.

      Als er nu eens een F1 journo is die je niet serieus moet nemen, is het Joe Saward wel. Die kerel leeft in zijn eigen droomwereld.

      • + 2
      • 1 jun 2017 - 22:48
    • Canson Po

      Posts: 2.324

      Is nog niet gezegd dat ze dit jaar niet hadden kunnen meedoen met een merc blok, hun chassis kan toch echt niet zo slecht zijn.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 22:53
    • Stitch

      Posts: 6.063

      @Schwantz: de laatste keer dat een Honda-team er een Mercedesmotor in legde werden ze wereldkampioen ;-)

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 07:22
    • speedy_bob

      Posts: 98

      @Boutsen: ivm Joe Saward: kan je concrete voorbeelden geven over waarom hij niet betrouwbaar zou zijn aub?

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 09:11
    • Boutsen

      Posts: 709

      @Speedy, bv. Ron Dennis die Manor wou kopen, Force India zou op de fles gaan, VW komt terug naar de F1, SMP (sponsor Sirotkin) zou Sauber overnemen, ...

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 09:56
    • Speedl9

      Posts: 645

      Klopte tot dat Manor de dood in ging door Friedrich of hoe die pino heet.
      Force India ging de afgrond in door hun lieve baas en zijn witwaspraktijken, kregen een nieuwe sponsor en gaat al 2 jaar goed.
      VW wou terugkomen, maar Honda-gate schikt iedereen af.
      Sauber ging een andere richting op zonder coureur afhankelijke sponsoring.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 19:22
  • weeterniksvan

    Posts: 1.406

    Laten we zeggen dat Red Bull dan de Honda motor neemt, en Ilmor daar aan koppelt. Iedereen weer blij.

    • + 0
    • 1 jun 2017 - 17:44
    • SCHOUTEN RACING FAN

      Posts: 3.933

      Jep en ilmor is al aan het werk voor honda. Honda maakt er een potje van zodat ze onder mc laren uit kunnen. Ze willen graag aan redbull leveren maar mocht niet van mc laren dan maar zo

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 20:40
  • WC MAX

    Posts: 6.066

    Is Isuzu niet ook een Japans merk? Wellicht dat daar de samenwerking mee gezocht kan worden....

    • + 0
    • 1 jun 2017 - 18:43
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      Of Subaru. Dan krijgen we een 4WD F1 die overigens NOOIT kapot zal gaan.

      • + 3
      • 1 jun 2017 - 18:46
    • WC MAX

      Posts: 6.066

      hahaha met een betere sound.

      • + 1
      • 1 jun 2017 - 19:16
    • InfinityG35

      Posts: 1.315

      @Ben

      haha, Subaru en F1 was in de jaren 90 een complete ramp. Daar is de Honda niets bij :D

      en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_1235

      • + 2
      • 1 jun 2017 - 20:39
    • F1-06

      Posts: 617

      @Infinity

      En toch was het een gaaf blok. 12 cilinder boxer, 5 kleppen per cilinder (60 totaal dus) en een 3.5 liter. Alleen jammer van de onbetrouwbaarheid; misschien dat dat blok met de kennis en materialen van nu wel betrouwbaar kan worden.

      • + 1
      • 1 jun 2017 - 21:07
    • Maxiaans

      Posts: 7.967

      Wahahaa F1-06.. Een kamaraad van mij had een V88, 6v per cilinder met 18 liter inhoud.. Dat ding brullen jonge! Maar kwam niet vooruit, haha.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 22:13
    • Ben Dover

      Posts: 2.105

      Haha, dat wist ik niet. Ik baseerde me meer op hun reputatie mbt straatauto's :) Leuke info!

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 23:40
  • Kennie

    Posts: 2.659

    Ik denk dat Boullier er zelf uitvliegt aan het einde van het jaar.

    • + 0
    • 1 jun 2017 - 20:01
    • Larry Perkins

      Posts: 47.777

      Vliegen? Denk jij dat ze de Bolle de lucht in krijgen? ;)

      • + 1
      • 2 jun 2017 - 00:18
  • Darlos Cainz

    Posts: 5.665

    ???? Ik dacht dat vorige week juist de bevestiging werd gerapporteerd dat McLaren doorgaat met Honda????

    • + 0
    • 1 jun 2017 - 21:29
    • Boutsen

      Posts: 709

      Volgens het reglement wel, maar gezien dit reglement kaas met gaatjes is, kan het nog alle kanten uit.

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 22:41
    • Ouw-sjagerijn

      Posts: 12.878

      Zakkie de Bruin heeft het zelf gezegd : wij gaan gewoon door met Honda .

      • + 0
      • 1 jun 2017 - 23:08
    • Kevin

      Posts: 5.294

      Dit is ook een bericht van vorige week.

      • + 1
      • 1 jun 2017 - 23:27
    • Larry Perkins

      Posts: 47.777

      In de F1 is zelfs het verleden niet zeker want de geschiedenis wordt vaak verdraaid.
      Het heden verandert per minuut en de toekomst per dag.

      De weersverwachting voor de GP van Canada geeft nog de meeste houvast.

      • + 1
      • 2 jun 2017 - 00:18
  • Arie54

    Posts: 4.960

    En dan....?

    • + 0
    • 2 jun 2017 - 09:24
    • HondaRA271

      Posts: 272

      En dan.......geld betalen voor een motor (Mercedes?) waar je sowieso geen kampioen mee wordt en het volledige salaris van Alonso betalen...ik zeg: doen !!! McLaren, goeie deal.

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 10:05
    • Larry Perkins

      Posts: 47.777

      ... is er koffie. Toch?

      Het enige dat loopt als een Ferrari van 2017 bij McLaren is de nieuwe kofficampagne met als topper het bakje Honda-verkeerd. Dat hebben ze toch niet afgeschaft?

      • + 0
      • 2 jun 2017 - 14:11
  • Speedl9

    Posts: 645

    McLaren met een Ferrari motor! Ik zeg doen!

    • + 0
    • 2 jun 2017 - 19:24

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